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Zabougornov
Äîáðûé Àäìèíèñòðàòîð (èíîãäà)


: 06.03.2005
: 12000
: Îáåð-ãðóïïåí-äîöåíò, ñò. ðóêîâîäèòåëü ãðóïïû ñêîðîñòíûõ ñâèíãåðîâ, îí æå Çàáàøëåâè÷ Îöààò Ïîýëåâè÷

: , 21 2009, 00:00:51     :

koshka ():

Îòòîðãíóòü â äàííîì ñëó÷àå îò Èçðàèëÿ, åñòåñòâííî Smile. È òàêèì îáðàçîì ñäåëàòü óñòóïêó Íåòàíèÿãó Smile (Ñåé÷àñ ïîíÿòíåå? Smile)

Íè÷åãî íå ïîíÿòíî. Êòî áóäåò îòòîðãàòü? Íåòàíèÿãó ÷òîáû ñäåëàòü óñòóïêó Íåòàíèÿãó?
_________________
A la guerre comme a la guerre èëè âòîðàÿ ðåäàêöèÿ Çàáóãîðíîâà
koshka



: 24.05.2006
: 876
: Israel,Mexico,Israel

: , 21 2009, 06:18:03     :

Zabougornov ():
koshka ():

Îòòîðãíóòü â äàííîì ñëó÷àå îò Èçðàèëÿ, åñòåñòâííî Smile. È òàêèì îáðàçîì ñäåëàòü óñòóïêó Íåòàíèÿãó Smile (Ñåé÷àñ ïîíÿòíåå? Smile)

Íè÷åãî íå ïîíÿòíî. Êòî áóäåò îòòîðãàòü? Íåòàíèÿãó ÷òîáû ñäåëàòü óñòóïêó Íåòàíèÿãó?

À êàê æå åùå? ÏÀ äåëàòü óñòóïêó çà îòòîðæåíèå îò Èçðàèëÿ èñêîííûõ ïàëåñòèíñêèõ çåìåëü? Êàêàÿ æ ýòî óñòóïêà. Ýòî èõ êðîâíîå. Smile Íó êòî-òî êîìó-òî äîëæåí óñòóïèòü, ÷òîáû áûëî ïðèÿòíî è áûë íàñòîÿùèé êîìïðîìèññSmile Çíà÷èò Íåòàíèÿãó âûíóæäåí óñòóïèòü ñàì ñåáå Smile
Èíòåðåñíî âñå-òàêè, êàêîé ãîðîä ñ Âàøåé òî÷êè çðåíèÿ ñòîëèöà Èçðàèëÿ Smile.
Ïîñëå ýòîãî áóäåò ÿñíåå íàñêîëüêî ðåàëüíî Âû ñåáå ïðåäñòàâëÿåòå ïîëîæåíèå âåùåé è ñòîèò ëè îñîáî óòðóæäàòüñÿ äèñêóòèðóÿ ñ Âàìè.
koshka



: 24.05.2006
: 876
: Israel,Mexico,Israel

: , 21 2009, 06:49:24     :

Zabougornov ():

Èëè ïðîñòî çàäà¸òå ïðîèçâîëüíûå âîïðîñû, âðîäå áû ïî òåìå, ÷òîáû îòêëîíèòüñÿ â òó èëè èíóþ ñòîðîíó è óéòè îò îáñóæäåíèÿ ñóòè äåëà?

ß î òîì, ÷òîáû îïðåäåëèòü, êàêèìè ïîçíàíèÿìè Âû îáëàäàåòå.
Î êàêîé ñóòè ðå÷ü, åñëè Âû ñîçäàåòå òåìû è àðãóìåíòèðóåòå èëè ïðèâîäèòå ( êàê óæ óãîäíî) òåíäåíöèîçíî íàäåðãàííûå ìåòåðèàëû. Åñòåñòâåííî ÿ çàäàþñü âîïðîñàìè : èëè Âû äåéñòâèòåëüíî íå çíàåòå ðåàëèé, èëè âàëÿåòå è äóðàêà, èëè íè÷åãî íå âàëÿåòå...
×òî áóäóò äåëàòü ñ ïîñåëåíèÿìè áîëåå èëè ìåíåå ÿñíî.
Èç àíêëàâíûõ óéäóò, óñòðîèâ "àöàãîò" äëÿ ïðèëè÷èÿ. Òå, êîòîðûå õîòü êàê-òî âïèøóòñÿ â òåððèòîðèòîðèþ Èçðàèëÿ îòãîðîäÿò ñòðîÿùèìñÿ çàáîðîì. Î òåõ, êîòîðûå ïîëíîñòüþ èíòåãðîâàíû â Èçðàèëü, òàê êàê "ïðèãîðîä" (åñëè Âàì òàê óãîäíî) Ãèëî è ðå÷è íè ñ êåì íå áóäåò. Ò.å. ìîæåò áûòü è ïîãîâîðÿò, íî íåðåçóëüòàòèâíî. Ïîãîâîðÿò ñ íåëþáèìûìè Âàìè àìåðèêàíöàìè (ýòîãî, êàê ïðàâèëî , äîñòàòî÷íî). À òå ïîïðîñÿò ñòðîèòü òèõîíüêî, áåç ïîëèòè÷åñêèõ çàÿâëåíèé, êàê óæå áûëî íåîäíîêðàòíî. Ïîëèòè÷åñêîìó íàæèìó íàó÷èëèñü ïðîòèâîñòîÿòü.
×åìó íå íàó÷èëèñü ïðîòèâîñòîÿòü. Íàëîãó, êîòîðûé óñòàíîâèëè ñòðàíû Åâðîñîþçà íà òîâàðû, ïðîèçâåäåííûå íà "òåððèòîðèÿõ". Ò.å. òîâàðû ïûòàþòñÿ ñäåëàòü íåêîíêóðåíòíîñïîñîáíûìè. Ñ ïðîáëåìîé "÷àñòè÷íî" ñïðàâëÿþòñÿ , óðåçàÿ çàðïëàòó ðàáîòíèêàì-àðàáàì ñ òåððèòîðèé, à òå íàëîãè íå ïëàòÿò àâòîíîìèè. Òàêîãî â ñåòüåâîé ýíöèêëîïåäèè íåò? ( Èñêàòü íå õî÷åòñÿ) Íàâåðíîå íåò è òîãî, ÷òî ñâîäÿò, âûïîëíÿÿ ðåçîëþöèè ÎÎÍ, ñ÷åòû ñ ïåíñèîíåðàìè, ïðîæèâàþùèìè â ïîñåëåíèÿõ è "ïðèãîðîäàõ" òèïà Ãèëî. Èì ïåíñèÿ îò íåêîòîðûõ åâðîïåéñêèõ ñòðàí íå ïîëîæåíà.
Ýòî ïî ñóòè ïðîáëåìû ïîñåëåíèé?
Zabougornov
Äîáðûé Àäìèíèñòðàòîð (èíîãäà)


: 06.03.2005
: 12000
: Îáåð-ãðóïïåí-äîöåíò, ñò. ðóêîâîäèòåëü ãðóïïû ñêîðîñòíûõ ñâèíãåðîâ, îí æå Çàáàøëåâè÷ Îöààò Ïîýëåâè÷

: , 21 2009, 14:55:22     :

Âî êàê ñåáÿ íåêîòîðûå ïîñåëåíöû âåäóò! Êðàäóò â ñîñåäíèõ àðàáñêèõ äåðåâíÿõ, ðàçðóøàþò äîìà, ïîäæèãàþò ïîëÿ, âûêîð÷åâûâàþò è óíè÷òîæàþò îëèâû.

Óïîðíî è ïîñëåäàâàòåëüíî ñåþò ñåìåíà íåíàâèñòè è ñåìåíà ýòè äàþò îáèëüíûå âñõîäû....

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1129358.html
Twilight Zone / Mourning uprooted olive trees in West Bank villages
By Gideon Levy
Tags: Israel news, Gideon Levy

The old tractor sputtered up the hill, its engine seemingly about to expire, but its big wheels bumping across the rocky terrain. We stood in the back, swaying wildly, holding on for dear life. On the hilltop loomed the big antenna of the settlement of Yitzhar, whose houses lay on the other side of the hill. The very knowledge of their presence inspired dread. It was a glorious sunny day, the spectacular valley sprawling below. The houses of the Palestinian village of Burin lie in this valley, which lies between two hills: on one stands Yitzhar; on the other, Har Bracha, outside Nablus.

Burin is caught between a rock and hard place, between Har Bracha and Yitzhar. We have visited Burin often, most recently after settlers burned down some of its homes. Settlers once stole a horse from a villager, torched fields, demolished a home in the village and uprooted olive trees. We have frequently documented the uprooting of olive trees: Less than a month ago, in this space, we told the story of the beautiful vineyard belonging to the agriculture teacher Mohammed Abu Awad from the village of Mureir, whose 300 trees were felled by intruders - probably from the illegal outpost of Adei Ad - using buzz saws.

Here, clues left by the criminals suggest that they used handsaws and ripped out the crowns of the trees with their hands, one crown after another, one branch after another, rending and wounding the trees. In Mureir, the agriculture teacher wrapped the stumps in sacks, giving them the look of figures in shrouds. Here, in Burin, the stumps remain where they were hurled on the ground, stacks of dead wood, branches withering, until finally the farmer will use them as firewood to heat the village's clay ovens, the tabuns.

But the feeling is the same, the affront is the same and so is the grief. In October, the farmer Abu Awad said about the ruins of his vineyard in Mureir: "What must you feel if you plant and tend and then it's all cut down? What must I feel? If I had been there, I'd have told them, cut off my hands, but don't cut down my trees - What did the tree do to them, for them to treat it like this?" (Haaretz Magazine, October 16)

And now the farmer Ibrahim Imran tells us in Burin: "These trees are like my children." Hands or children, the grief of those who tend their olive groves is searing and deeply moving. The inability of the soldiers of the Israel Defense Forces and of the officers of the Israel Police to protect the groves of these farmers, to protect their property and their honor, is the inability of all of us.

We stood on the rear fender of the tractor as it clambered its way up the hill. Standing with us was Ruth Kedar, an activist from Machsom Watch, which monitors checkpoints, and Yesh Din (Volunteers for Human Rights). She has crisscrossed the territories in her private car for years, documenting wrongs and injustice. Her husband, retired colonel Paul Kedar, is also active in Yesh Din. It's worth lingering over his riveting biography: Paul Kedar comes from a Revisionist family; his father was one of Ze'ev Jabotinsky's secretaries. He himself was one of the founders of the Israel Air Force and later served as air attache in Paris during the period of the Sinai Campaign. He has been in the Mossad and served as consul general in New York, among other state posts. He was a friend of Moshe Dayan and Shimon Peres. He too now devotes his time to documenting the occupation and struggling against its abuses. The Kedars, now in their eighties, will soon receive the Emil Grunzweig Human Rights Award from the Association for Civil Rights in Israel, and deservedly so.

Above the noise of the tractor, one of the Palestinian farmers tells us that he heard that his neighbor, Rabbi Yitzhak Shapira, from Yitzhar, has permitted the killing of all non-Jews. Indeed, Shapira, head of the Od Yosef Hai yeshiva in Yitzhar (named for the biblical Joseph), recently published a book, "The King's Torah," in which he states that it is permissible to kill every gentile who constitutes a threat to the Jewish people, even if he is a child or an infant.

When Imran arrived to work his land early Thursday morning, he was appalled. It was, he says, "the height of frustration," and adds: "After God, I rely only on my olive trees. These trees are no less than 70 years old. My great-great-grandfather planted them."

Imran called everyone he could think of - the District Coordinations Offices, the International Red Cross, B'Tselem and Yesh Din - and also filed a complaint with the Israel Police at Ariel. Investigators came to the grove and took fingerprints, he says, but he has yet to receive confirmation of having submitted a report. Yesh Din is now handling his complaint.

An IDF jeep suddenly arrives to see what's going on - just the kind of jeep that rarely shows up when the settlers go on a rampage.

A spokesman for the Shai (Samaria-Judea) District of the police stated in response: "On November 12, a resident of Burin complained that he noticed that 90 olive trees on his land had been chopped down. The damage was documented by the criminal investigations department at the site, and trackers scoured the area to find footprints. Testimonies were taken from two locals: the owner of the land and his worker. The police are conducting additional investigative activities, among them locating suspects and witnesses. The Samaria District police are also operating on the intelligence plane."
_________________
A la guerre comme a la guerre èëè âòîðàÿ ðåäàêöèÿ Çàáóãîðíîâà
Zabougornov
Äîáðûé Àäìèíèñòðàòîð (èíîãäà)


: 06.03.2005
: 12000
: Îáåð-ãðóïïåí-äîöåíò, ñò. ðóêîâîäèòåëü ãðóïïû ñêîðîñòíûõ ñâèíãåðîâ, îí æå Çàáàøëåâè÷ Îöààò Ïîýëåâè÷

: , 21 2009, 15:13:15     :

koshka ():
Zabougornov ():
koshka ():

Îòòîðãíóòü â äàííîì ñëó÷àå îò Èçðàèëÿ, åñòåñòâííî Smile. È òàêèì îáðàçîì ñäåëàòü óñòóïêó Íåòàíèÿãó Smile (Ñåé÷àñ ïîíÿòíåå? Smile)

Íè÷åãî íå ïîíÿòíî. Êòî áóäåò îòòîðãàòü? Íåòàíèÿãó ÷òîáû ñäåëàòü óñòóïêó Íåòàíèÿãó?

À êàê æå åùå? ÏÀ äåëàòü óñòóïêó çà îòòîðæåíèå îò Èçðàèëÿ èñêîííûõ ïàëåñòèíñêèõ çåìåëü? Êàêàÿ æ ýòî óñòóïêà. Ýòî èõ êðîâíîå. Smile Íó êòî-òî êîìó-òî äîëæåí óñòóïèòü, ÷òîáû áûëî ïðèÿòíî è áûë íàñòîÿùèé êîìïðîìèññSmile Çíà÷èò Íåòàíèÿãó âûíóæäåí óñòóïèòü ñàì ñåáå Smile

À êîìïðîìèññ òîæå ìåæäó Íåòàíèÿãó è Íåòàíèÿãó?
koshka ():

Èíòåðåñíî âñå-òàêè, êàêîé ãîðîä ñ Âàøåé òî÷êè çðåíèÿ ñòîëèöà Èçðàèëÿ Smile.

Èåðóñàëèì, â ìåæäóíàðîäíî ïðèçíàíûõ ãðàíèöàõ, èñêëþ÷àÿ îêêóïèðîâàííûå òåððèòîðèè.
koshka ():

Ïîñëå ýòîãî áóäåò ÿñíåå íàñêîëüêî ðåàëüíî Âû ñåáå ïðåäñòàâëÿåòå ïîëîæåíèå âåùåé è ñòîèò ëè îñîáî óòðóæäàòüñÿ äèñêóòèðóÿ ñ Âàìè.

Óæå óòðóæäàåòåñü. Ïî ôàêòó äèñêóññèè. È äàëüøå áóäåòå óòðóæäàòüñÿ. Ïîòîìó ÷òî Âàñ ìîÿ ïîçèöèÿ çàäåâàåò, èíà÷å Âû áû íå âñòóïèëè â äèñêóññèþ. È äàæå áóäåòå îñîáî óòðóæäàòüñÿ, ïîäûñêèâàÿ àðãóìåíòû è äîâîäû, ïîòîìó ÷òî áåç íèõ Âàøà ïîçèöèÿ áóäåò èìåòü áëåäíûé âèä. À íàéòè ýòè àðãóìåíòû î÷åíü íåïðîñòî, ïîýòîìó - îñîáî óòðóæäàòüñÿ. Äåêëàðàöèè èíñïèðèðîâàííûå èçðàèëüñêîé ïðîïàãàíäîé íå êàòÿò ïðîòèâ àðãóìåíòîâ è ôàêòîâ.
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A la guerre comme a la guerre èëè âòîðàÿ ðåäàêöèÿ Çàáóãîðíîâà


: Zabougornov (, 21 2009, 15:17:30), 1
Zabougornov
Äîáðûé Àäìèíèñòðàòîð (èíîãäà)


: 06.03.2005
: 12000
: Îáåð-ãðóïïåí-äîöåíò, ñò. ðóêîâîäèòåëü ãðóïïû ñêîðîñòíûõ ñâèíãåðîâ, îí æå Çàáàøëåâè÷ Îöààò Ïîýëåâè÷

: , 21 2009, 15:15:56     :

koshka ():
Zabougornov ():

Èëè ïðîñòî çàäà¸òå ïðîèçâîëüíûå âîïðîñû, âðîäå áû ïî òåìå, ÷òîáû îòêëîíèòüñÿ â òó èëè èíóþ ñòîðîíó è óéòè îò îáñóæäåíèÿ ñóòè äåëà?

ß î òîì, ÷òîáû îïðåäåëèòü, êàêèìè ïîçíàíèÿìè Âû îáëàäàåòå.
Î êàêîé ñóòè ðå÷ü, åñëè Âû ñîçäàåòå òåìû è àðãóìåíòèðóåòå èëè ïðèâîäèòå ( êàê óæ óãîäíî) òåíäåíöèîçíî íàäåðãàííûå ìåòåðèàëû. Åñòåñòâåííî ÿ çàäàþñü âîïðîñàìè : èëè Âû äåéñòâèòåëüíî íå çíàåòå ðåàëèé, èëè âàëÿåòå è äóðàêà, èëè íè÷åãî íå âàëÿåòå...
×òî áóäóò äåëàòü ñ ïîñåëåíèÿìè áîëåå èëè ìåíåå ÿñíî.
Èç àíêëàâíûõ óéäóò, óñòðîèâ "àöàãîò" äëÿ ïðèëè÷èÿ. Òå, êîòîðûå õîòü êàê-òî âïèøóòñÿ â òåððèòîðèòîðèþ Èçðàèëÿ îòãîðîäÿò ñòðîÿùèìñÿ çàáîðîì. Î òåõ, êîòîðûå ïîëíîñòüþ èíòåãðîâàíû â Èçðàèëü, òàê êàê "ïðèãîðîä" (åñëè Âàì òàê óãîäíî) Ãèëî è ðå÷è íè ñ êåì íå áóäåò. Ò.å. ìîæåò áûòü è ïîãîâîðÿò, íî íåðåçóëüòàòèâíî. Ïîãîâîðÿò ñ íåëþáèìûìè Âàìè àìåðèêàíöàìè (ýòîãî, êàê ïðàâèëî , äîñòàòî÷íî). À òå ïîïðîñÿò ñòðîèòü òèõîíüêî, áåç ïîëèòè÷åñêèõ çàÿâëåíèé, êàê óæå áûëî íåîäíîêðàòíî. Ïîëèòè÷åñêîìó íàæèìó íàó÷èëèñü ïðîòèâîñòîÿòü.
×åìó íå íàó÷èëèñü ïðîòèâîñòîÿòü. Íàëîãó, êîòîðûé óñòàíîâèëè ñòðàíû Åâðîñîþçà íà òîâàðû, ïðîèçâåäåííûå íà "òåððèòîðèÿõ". Ò.å. òîâàðû ïûòàþòñÿ ñäåëàòü íåêîíêóðåíòíîñïîñîáíûìè. Ñ ïðîáëåìîé "÷àñòè÷íî" ñïðàâëÿþòñÿ , óðåçàÿ çàðïëàòó ðàáîòíèêàì-àðàáàì ñ òåððèòîðèé, à òå íàëîãè íå ïëàòÿò àâòîíîìèè. Òàêîãî â ñåòüåâîé ýíöèêëîïåäèè íåò? ( Èñêàòü íå õî÷åòñÿ) Íàâåðíîå íåò è òîãî, ÷òî ñâîäÿò, âûïîëíÿÿ ðåçîëþöèè ÎÎÍ, ñ÷åòû ñ ïåíñèîíåðàìè, ïðîæèâàþùèìè â ïîñåëåíèÿõ è "ïðèãîðîäàõ" òèïà Ãèëî. Èì ïåíñèÿ îò íåêîòîðûõ åâðîïåéñêèõ ñòðàí íå ïîëîæåíà.
Ýòî ïî ñóòè ïðîáëåìû ïîñåëåíèé?

Ýòî - ïî ñóòè. Ïî ïîâîäó íàëîãà - åñòü êîíêðåòíûå äàííûå?
_________________
A la guerre comme a la guerre èëè âòîðàÿ ðåäàêöèÿ Çàáóãîðíîâà
koshka



: 24.05.2006
: 876
: Israel,Mexico,Israel

: , 21 2009, 16:12:05     :

Zabougornov ():

Èåðóñàëèì, â ìåæäóíàðîäíî ïðèçíàíûõ ãðàíèöàõ, èñêëþ÷àÿ îêêóïèðîâàííûå òåððèòîðèè.

Smile, åñëè áû åùå ðåàëüíî ïðåäñòàâëÿëè ãäå îíè ( îêóïèðîâàííûå òåððèòîðèè è ìåæäóíàðîäíî ïðèçíàííûå ãðàíèöû), ïîíÿëè áû ÷òî ïîâòîðÿåòå ÷óæèå ãëóïîñòè. Äàëüíåéøàÿ äèñêóññèÿ- ñîòðÿñàíèå âîçäóõà

Zabougornov ():
Óæå óòðóæäàåòåñü. Ïî ôàêòó äèñêóññèè. È äàëüøå áóäåòå óòðóæäàòüñÿ. Ïîòîìó ÷òî Âàñ ìîÿ ïîçèöèÿ çàäåâàåò,

Óæå íå óòðóæäàþñü è àáñîëþòíî íå çàäåâàåòSmile. Êàê ìåíÿ ìîæåò çàäåâàòü, äîáðîâîëüíîå æàëàíèå îïïîíåíòà ïðåâðàòèòü ñåáÿ â äóðàêà (íå çíàÿ íå ó÷èòûâàÿ ðåàëèé, áåðåòñÿ îáñóæäàòü âåñüìà ñåðüåçíûå ïðîáëåìû )?


: koshka (, 21 2009, 16:42:50), 3 ()
koshka



: 24.05.2006
: 876
: Israel,Mexico,Israel

: , 21 2009, 16:20:26     :

Zabougornov ():
Âî êàê ñåáÿ íåêîòîðûå ïîñåëåíöû âåäóò! Êðàäóò â ñîñåäíèõ àðàáñêèõ äåðåâíÿõ, ðàçðóøàþò äîìà, ïîäæèãàþò ïîëÿ, âûêîð÷åâûâàþò è óíè÷òîæàþò îëèâû.

Óïîðíî è ïîñëåäàâàòåëüíî ñåþò ñåìåíà íåíàâèñòè è ñåìåíà ýòè äàþò îáèëüíûå âñõîäû....

Ýòî àðãóìåíò â äèñêóññèè?Smile Íå ñåðüåçíî! Smile
Ëþäè- ñóùåñòâà ìàëîïðèÿòíûå. Ýòî èçâåñòíî.
Ðåøåíèå îïèñàííîé Âàìè ïðîáëåìû î÷åíü ïðîñòîå.
Âîðîâ, ìàðîäåðîâ, ïîãðîìùèêîâ ñóäèòü óïîðíî è ïîñëåäîâàòåëüíî, ÷òîáû ýòè ñåìåíà íå äàâàëè îáèëüíûõ âñõîäîâ Smile
×òî ïðîèçîéäåò ñ ïîñåëåíÿìè ÿ óæå ïèñÀë Smile
Zabougornov
Äîáðûé Àäìèíèñòðàòîð (èíîãäà)


: 06.03.2005
: 12000
: Îáåð-ãðóïïåí-äîöåíò, ñò. ðóêîâîäèòåëü ãðóïïû ñêîðîñòíûõ ñâèíãåðîâ, îí æå Çàáàøëåâè÷ Îöààò Ïîýëåâè÷

: , 25 2009, 10:24:34     :

koshka ():
Zabougornov ():
Âî êàê ñåáÿ íåêîòîðûå ïîñåëåíöû âåäóò! Êðàäóò â ñîñåäíèõ àðàáñêèõ äåðåâíÿõ, ðàçðóøàþò äîìà, ïîäæèãàþò ïîëÿ, âûêîð÷åâûâàþò è óíè÷òîæàþò îëèâû.

Óïîðíî è ïîñëåäàâàòåëüíî ñåþò ñåìåíà íåíàâèñòè è ñåìåíà ýòè äàþò îáèëüíûå âñõîäû....

Ýòî àðãóìåíò â äèñêóññèè?Smile Íå ñåðüåçíî! Smile
Ëþäè- ñóùåñòâà ìàëîïðèÿòíûå. Ýòî èçâåñòíî.
Ðåøåíèå îïèñàííîé Âàìè ïðîáëåìû î÷åíü ïðîñòîå.
Âîðîâ, ìàðîäåðîâ, ïîãðîìùèêîâ ñóäèòü óïîðíî è ïîñëåäîâàòåëüíî, ÷òîáû ýòè ñåìåíà íå äàâàëè îáèëüíûõ âñõîäîâ Smile
×òî ïðîèçîéäåò ñ ïîñåëåíÿìè ÿ óæå ïèñÀë Smile


Ñóäèòü èõ êîíå÷íî íàäî. Óæå ñóäÿò. Ïðàâäà íè îäíîãî åù¸ íå îñóäèëè...

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1130480.html
Rights group: 69 cases of Palestinian olive trees destroyed, but no prosecutions
By Chaim Levinson, Haaretz Correspondent
Tags: Yesh Din, Israel news

The human rights organization Yesh Din says not one of the 69 complaints filed during the past four years on damage to Palestinians' trees in the West Bank has resulted in an indictment. The organization released a report on the matter Tuesday and makes specific reference to damage caused to olive groves, central to the livelihood of Palestinian villagers.

The olive harvest season is coming to an end in most parts of the West Bank this week, with the exception of those areas at higher elevations. Attacks targeting trees harvested by Palestinians - olive trees in particular, but also almond, fig, lemon and others - has been on the rise in recent years.

During the past four years, Yesh Din filed 69 complaints which are under investigation by police in the West Bank. The toll involves many thousands of trees in numerous areas, from Susya in the southern Hebron Hills to Salem in northern Samaria.
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According to the report, 27 cases (40 percent of the cases for which complaints were filed) were documented between January and October of this year. Notwithstanding Israel Defense Forces reports that the olive harvest passed "quietly" during the months of September and October, the human rights group reported dozens of incidents in which hundreds of Palestinian trees were damaged.

According to the reports, not a single one of the 69 cases under investigation has led to an indictment of the suspects. Fourteen cases are still under investigation; another four are being evaluated by police and state prosecutors, and a decision is pending on whether the authorities will press charges against the suspects.

"Continuous damage to the livelihood of Palestinian families is not met with immediate response from the law enforcement authorities," said Lior Yavne, head of research at Yesh Din.

"Yesh Din's multi-year follow up on the results of investigations into violations carried out by Israeli citizens against Palestinians shows that nearly 92 percent of the investigations fail, and the cases are closed without charges being filed," he added. "The incidents of damage to the trees, [and] the rate of failure of the investigations conducted by Judea and Samaria District [police] is 100 percent."

In response to these claims, the Yesha Council of settlements says "We have followed for years the dozens of cases of damage to Jewish farmers, and our report, 'Who will Defend my Olive Tree?' shows that selective law enforcement exists. All authorities go out of their way to protect the Arab farmer. On the other hand, they do not even investigate the complaints of the Jewish farmer. There are restraining orders against Jews during the olive harvest season but nothing against the Arabs."
_________________
A la guerre comme a la guerre èëè âòîðàÿ ðåäàêöèÿ Çàáóãîðíîâà
Zabougornov
Äîáðûé Àäìèíèñòðàòîð (èíîãäà)


: 06.03.2005
: 12000
: Îáåð-ãðóïïåí-äîöåíò, ñò. ðóêîâîäèòåëü ãðóïïû ñêîðîñòíûõ ñâèíãåðîâ, îí æå Çàáàøëåâè÷ Îöààò Ïîýëåâè÷

: , 25 2009, 20:14:33     :

Áó-ãà-ãà! Êàêîé, îäíàêî, ìàëåíüêèé ôèãîâûé ëèñòîê!

Ýòî íàçûâàåòñÿ - çàìîðîçèëè ñòðîèòåëüñòâî íà òåððèòîðèÿõ.  âîñòî÷íîì Èåðóñàëèìå - âñ¸ ïî-ïðåæíåìó, íè÷åãî íå çàìîðîæåíî. Íà îñòàëüíûõ îêêóïèðîâàííûõ òåððèòîðèÿõ - òî ÷òî íà÷àëè ñòðîèòü áóäóò ïðîäîëæàòü. Ìû òàêæå ïðîäîëæèì ñòðîèòåëüñòâî ñèíàãîã, äåòñêèõ ñàäîâ, øêîë è îáùåñòâåííûõ çäàíèé áåç âñÿêèõ îãðàíè÷åíèé ïîâþäó, íà âñåõ îêêóïèðîâàííûõ òåððèòîðèÿõ. Âî êàê!

Îí, ïî-ìîåìó, âîîáùå óæå ïàëåñòèíöåâ çà ïîñëåäíèõ ôðàåðîâ äåðæèò. Ïîñìîòðèì, îäíàêî, êàêîé áóäåò îòâåò....

http://www.newsru.co.il/israel/25nov2009/netan507.html
Íåòàíèÿãó îôèöèàëüíî îáúÿâèë î ïðîãðàììå çàìîðàæèâàíèÿ ñòðîèòåëüñòâà â ïîñåëåíèÿõ

Íåòàíèÿãó îôèöèàëüíî îáúÿâèë î ïðîãðàììå çàìîðàæèâàíèÿ ñòðîèòåëüñòâà â ïîñåëåíèÿõ
Ïî çàâåðøåíèè 10 ìåñÿöåâ ñòðîèòåëüñòâî â ïîñåëåíèÿõ áóäåò ïðîäîëæåíî â ñîîòâåòñòâèè ñ ïðåäûäóùèìè ðåøåíèÿìè ïðàâèòåëüñòâ Èçðàèëÿ
Èçðàèëü ïîøåë íà ìíîæåñòâî óñòóïîê â îòíîøåíèè ïàëåñòèíöåâ, áûëè ñíÿòû ìíîãèå êîíòðîëüíî-ïðîïóñêíûå ïóíêòû è óâåëè÷åíî âðåìÿ ðàáîòû ïîãðàíè÷íûõ ïåðååçäîâ
Ãëàâà ïðàâèòåëüñòâà Áèíüÿìèí Íåòàíèÿãó âûñòóïèë ñ îôèöèàëüíûì çàÿâëåíèåì ïî ïîâîäó óòâåðæäåíèÿ ïðîãðàììû çàìîðàæèâàíèÿ ñòðîèòåëüñòâà æèëüÿ â åâðåéñêèõ íàñåëåííûõ ïóíêòàõ Èóäåè è Ñàìàðèè ñðîêîì íà äåñÿòü ìåñÿöåâ. Îí ïîä÷åðêíóë, ÷òî ýòà ïðîãðàììà íå ðàñïðîñòðàíÿåòñÿ íà Èåðóñàëèì.

- Óòâåðæäåíà ïðîãðàììà çàìîðàæèâàíèÿ ñòðîèòåëüñòâà â ïîñåëåíèÿõ íà 10 ìåñÿöåâ
- Çàìîðàæèâàíèå ñòðîèòåëüñòâà â ïîñåëåíèÿõ: ïðàâûé ëàãåðü âîçìóùåí, ëåâûé – îáðàäîâàí

"Ýòî íåëåãêèé è áîëåçíåííûé øàã, íî ìû èäåì íà ýòî èç ñîîáðàæåíèé ãîñóäàðñòâåííûõ èíòåðåñîâ. ß íàäåþñü, ÷òî ïàëåñòèíöû è àðàáñêèé ìèð âîñïîëüçóþòñÿ ýòîé âîçìîæíîñòüþ äëÿ âîçîáíîâëåíèÿ ìèðíîãî ïðîöåññà", – ïîä÷åðêíóë ãëàâà ïðàâèòåëüñòâà.

Íåòàíèÿãó îòìåòèë, ÷òî îí ìíîãîêðàòíî ïðèçûâàë ïàëåñòèíöåâ âîçîáíîâèòü ìèðíûå ïåðåãîâîðû è ïðåäëàãàë ðàçëè÷íûå âàðèàíòû âîçîáíîâëåíèÿ êîíòàêòîâ. "Îñíîâíàÿ ïðîáëåìà – íå â òîì, ÷òîáû ìû ñîãëàñèëèñü íà ïàëåñòèíñêîå ãîñóäàðñòâî, îíà â òîì, ÷òîáû ïàëåñòèíöû ïðèçíàëè ãîñóäàðñòâî åâðåéñêîå", – íàïîìíèë ïðåìüåð-ìèíèñòð.

Îí ñîîáùèë, ÷òî Èçðàèëü ïîøåë íà ìíîæåñòâî óñòóïîê â îòíîøåíèè ïàëåñòèíöåâ, áûëè ñíÿòû ìíîãèå êîíòðîëüíî-ïðîïóñêíûå ïóíêòû è óâåëè÷åíî âðåìÿ ðàáîòû ïîãðàíè÷íûõ ïåðååçäîâ.

Áèíüÿìèí Íåòàíèÿãó íàïîìíèë, ÷òî â ïðîøëîì îí ãîâîðèë î ãîòîâíîñòè Èçðàèëÿ ïðåêðàòèòü ñòðîèòåëüñòâî â ïîñåëåíèÿõ è îò÷óæäåíèå çåìëè â ïîëüçó åâðåéñêèõ íàñåëåííûõ ïóíêòîâ Èóäåè è Ñàìàðèè.

"Îäíàêî ÿ ãîâîðèë è ãîâîðþ: íåîáõîäèìî ïîçâîëèòü òåì, êòî æèâåò â Èóäåå è Ñàìàðèè, æèòü íîðìàëüíî. Ìû ïðîäîëæèì ñòðîèòü äåòñêèå ñàäû, øêîëû, ñèíàãîãè äëÿ ðàñòóùåãî íàñåëåíèÿ Èóäåè è Ñàìàðèè", – ïîä÷åðêíóë ãëàâà ïðàâèòåëüñòâà. Ïî ñëîâàì ãëàâû ïðàâèòåëüñòâà, íå áóäóò âûäàâàòüñÿ ðàçðåøåíèÿ íà ñòðîèòåëüñòâî æèëûõ äîìîâ - îáùåñòâåííûå çäàíèÿ áóäóò ñòðîèòüñÿ.

Ïî çàâåðøåíèè 10 ìåñÿöåâ ñòðîèòåëüñòâî â ïîñåëåíèÿõ áóäåò ïðîäîëæåíî â ñîîòâåòñòâèè ñ ïðåäûäóùèìè ðåøåíèÿìè ïðàâèòåëüñòâ Èçðàèëÿ.

 çàâåðøåíèå ñâîåé ðå÷è ãëàâà ïðàâèòåëüñòâà îáðàòèëñÿ ê ïàëåñòèíöàì ñ ïðèçûâîì âîçîáíîâèòü ïåðåãîâîðû.


Netanyahu declares 10-month settlement freeze 'to restart peace talks'
By Barak Ravid, Haaretz Correspondent, and Agencies
Tags: settlement freeze

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu announced on Wednesday evening that Israel would impose a 10-month freeze on construction in West Bank settlements, saying the move was a bid to restart stalled peace talks with the Palestinians.

"I hope that this decision will help launch meaningful negotiations to reach a historic peace agreement that would finally end the conflict between Israel and the Palestinians," Netanyahu said at a special press conference he held shortly after the security cabinet approved the moratorium.

He added: "We have been told by many of our friends that once Israel takes the first meaningful steps toward peace, the Palestinians and Arab states would respond."
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Settlement building has been a key sticking point in U.S. efforts to restart Middle East peace talks; the Palestinians say they will not return to the negotiating table without a complete halt to construction.

During the press conference, Netanyahu said the "far-reaching and painful" move would not be implemented in predominantly Arab East Jerusalem, which is viewed by Israel as a separate issue to be discussed in a final status agreement with the Palestinians.

"We do not put any restrictions on building in our sovereign capital," the premier said.

The freeze applies only to new construction, meaning housing already underway will continue. Also, Netanyahu said, only new homes are included.

"We will not halt existing construction and we will continue to build synagogues, schools, kindergartens and public buildings essential for normal life in the settlements," he said.

Netanyahu concluded with an appeal to the Palestinians to enter into a new round of peace talks.

"Now is the time to begin negotiations, now is the time to move forward towards peace," he said. "Israel today has taken a far-reaching step toward peace, it is time for the Palestinians to do the same."

He added: "Israel's government has made an important step toward peace today, let us make peace together."

Netanyahu: Settlement freeze will prove Israel really wants peace

At the cabinet vote, National Infrastructure Minister Uzi Landau (Yisrael Beiteinu) was the only minister to oppose the move.

Shortly before the cabinet session, Netanyahu said the freeze would prove that Israel genuinely seeks to reach peace with the Palestinians.

"In the international circumstances that have been created, this step will advance Israel's broad international interests. This is not a simple step, nor an easy one; but it has many more advantages than disadvantages," Netanyahu told his aides.

He added: "It will enable us to show the world this simple truth: The Government of Israel wants to enter into negotiations with the Palestinians, is taking practical steps to enter into negotiations and is very serious in its intention to advance peace."

At least one key Security Cabinet member, Defense Minister Ehud Barak, came out in favor of the proposal. "Its aim is to open a window for renewing negotiations with the Palestinians," he said.

"I hope that the Yesha [council of settlements] leadership, which is patriotic, responsible and serious, will understand the need for the decision at this time," Barak added.

"The understandings with the United States are of the utmost importance with regard to negotiations, and guarantees of security and its military supremacy."

An official statement from the Prime Minister's Office on Wednesday said Netanyahu would seek approval for the moratorium from his cabinet in order to boost peace prospects.

"As part of our efforts to give impetus to peace talks with the Palestinian Authority and promote Israel's comprehensive national interests, the prime minister will ask the security cabinet to approve a temporary suspension on construction permits for new residences and the [actual] start of new residential construction for a period of ten months," the statement said.

The move is not unexpected; Netanyahu announced several days ago that he intended to declare a settlement freeze for 10 months. Israel began building in the West Bank in 1967, following the capture of the territory from Jordan during the Six-Day War. Today, more than a quarter of million Israelis live in West Bank settlements.

The freeze will also not apply to construction that has already been authorized or to work on public buildings conducive to normal life in the territories.

Palestinian Prime Minister Salam Fayyad told reporters Wednesday that a settlement freeze was unacceptable without halt in construction in Jerusalem, which the Palestinians want as the capital of a state.

"What has changed to make something that what was not acceptable a week or 10 days ago [acceptable now]?," he told reporters. "The exclusion of Jerusalem is a very serious problem for us."
_________________
A la guerre comme a la guerre èëè âòîðàÿ ðåäàêöèÿ Çàáóãîðíîâà
Zabougornov
Äîáðûé Àäìèíèñòðàòîð (èíîãäà)


: 06.03.2005
: 12000
: Îáåð-ãðóïïåí-äîöåíò, ñò. ðóêîâîäèòåëü ãðóïïû ñêîðîñòíûõ ñâèíãåðîâ, îí æå Çàáàøëåâè÷ Îöààò Ïîýëåâè÷

: , 25 2009, 20:29:19     :

Íó òåïåðü Íåòàíèÿãó íóæíî èìåòü ìîùíóþ îõðàíó è ïîìåíüøå áûâàòü íà îáùåñòâåííûõ ìåðîïðèÿòèÿõ....

Enraged rightists on settlement freeze: Netanyahu spitting in our faces
By Jonathan Lis, Haaretz Correspondent
Tags: Israel news

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's plan for a 10-month freeze in West Bank settlement construction drew a wave of verbal attacks on Wednesday, with right-wingers accusing him of betraying his electoral base.

"It can't be possible that Netanyahu is spitting in the faces of those to whom he promised less than a year ago that he would constitute an alternative to Sharon's policy of uprooting," said MK Yaakov Katz, the chairman of the National Union.

He was referring to former prime minister Ariel Sharon's withdrawal of Israeli soldiers and settlers from the Gaza Strip in 2005.
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Riqht-wing activist Itamar Ben-Gvir accused Netanyahu of betraying the State of Israel.

"The time has for the right to fight Netanyahu the same way they fought Rabin, Olmert, Sharon, and Barak," he said, in reference to former Israeli premiers who were the target of rightist attacks.

Yitzhak Rabin was assassinated by a right-wing extremist in 1995 after entering into peace talks with the Palestinians.

MK Michael Ben-Ari (National Union), meanwhile, said members of Netanyahu's Likud party had given the premier "the right to lead Israel to disaster."

Ben-Ari added: "Netanyahu's decree of a settlement freeze is a capitulation the likes of which we haven't known since the days of Rabin."

Left and center parties, meanwhile, expressed uncertainty regarding Netanyahu's ability to follow through on the move.

The Kadima party expressed half-hearted support for the plan, saying it "supports every step that will return Israel to negotiations and to a permanent agreement."

Kadima MK Nachman Shai said that Netanyahu has proved time and again that his decisions can be changed, so it's therefore "better to wait and see if he will stick with his decision."

"If he changes his mind, it will be clear that Netanyahu hasn?t changed," continued Shai.

Another Kadima MK, Yoel Hasson, praised Netanyahu for "adopting Kadima's policy." He said that Netanyahu was "walking the same road as Sharon."
_________________
A la guerre comme a la guerre èëè âòîðàÿ ðåäàêöèÿ Çàáóãîðíîâà
Zabougornov
Äîáðûé Àäìèíèñòðàòîð (èíîãäà)


: 06.03.2005
: 12000
: Îáåð-ãðóïïåí-äîöåíò, ñò. ðóêîâîäèòåëü ãðóïïû ñêîðîñòíûõ ñâèíãåðîâ, îí æå Çàáàøëåâè÷ Îöààò Ïîýëåâè÷

: , 26 2009, 23:54:15     :

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article6920726.ece
US fury as Israel approves 900 new housing units in Gilo settlement
James Hider in Jerusalem
Israel's Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu gestures during his meeting with German President Horst Koehler

(Tobias Schwarz/Reuters)

Binyamin Netanyahu, Israel's Prime Minister, has had strained relations with President Barack Obama

Strained relations between Israel and the United States hit a fresh low yesterday when the State Department condemned the construction of 900 new housing units in an East Jerusalem settlement suburb as “dismaying”.

Britain also condemned the controversial decision by Israel to go ahead with the major construction project in Gilo, which was built on land conquered in the 1967 war, calling the move “wrong.”

The dispute brought to a head simmering tensions between Israel’s right-wing Government, headed by Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu, and its major backer, Washington. Almost immediately after he assumed office, President Barack Obama said he wanted a total freeze on all Jewish settlements in the West Bank and eastern Jerusalem, considered illegal by the international community, as a means of reinvigorating long-stalled peace talks.

But Mr Netanyahu has refused, blocking a central plank of the US administration’s policy to end the decades-old conflict. In a rare flash of diplomatic anger yesterday, State Department spokesman Ian Kelly said, “We find the Jerusalem planning committee decision to move forward the approval process for the expansion of Gilo, in Jerusalem, as dismaying.”

“We believe that these actions make it more difficult for our efforts to succeed,” he added.

A statement issued by the British consulate in Jerusalem added David Miliband’s displeasure to the US warning. “The Foreign Secretary has been very clear that a credible deal involves Jerusalem as a shared capital. Expanding settlements on occupied land in East Jerusalem makes that deal much harder. So this decision on Gilo is wrong and we oppose it,” the statement said.

In a sign of growing US anger, the State Department went even further, attacking Israel’s evictions of Palestinian families from war-conquered East Jerusalem and the regular demolition of Palestinian homes. “We object to this and we object to other Israeli practices in Jerusalem related to housing, including the continuing pattern of evictions and demolition of Palestinian homes,” Mr Kelly said.

Gilo is a lower middle class suburb of Jerusalem overlooking the Palestinian city of Bethlehem, which is also faced by another settlement suburb, named Har Homa, which sits right on its boundaries and where construction work has also been continuing.

Israeli media reported yesterday that Mr Obama’s regional envoy, George Mitchell, had asked Mr Netanyahu’s representative Yitzhak Molcho to suspend plans to build the 900 new Gilo homes — mostly four- to-five bedroom apartments, intended to attract better-off investors — but his request had been flatly denied.

The daily Yediot Ahronoth said Mr Molcho replied that Gilo was an “integral part” of Jerusalem and that construction permits were issued in the same way as they would be in Tel Aviv. US officials were said to be frustrated by the “procedural” nature of the response, as the Palestinians have said they will not resume any negotiations until all settlement growth is put on ice.

The Palestinians want East Jerusalem — which includes the historical Old City, full of sites holy to Jews, Muslims and Christians — as the capital of their future state, while Mr Netanyahu has said the city is Israel’s indivisible capital. An Israeli official said Mr Netanyahu “is ready to show the maximum restraint when it comes to construction in Judea and Samaria [the West Bank] to help restart negotiations, but this policy does not apply in Jerusalem, our capital.”

Furious at Israel’s position, the Palestinian leadership has said it plans a universal declaration of independence and will approach the United Nations for endorsement. That move in turn angered Israel, with some ministers calling for a unilateral annexation of areas of the West Bank containing Israeli settlements.
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A la guerre comme a la guerre èëè âòîðàÿ ðåäàêöèÿ Çàáóãîðíîâà
Zabougornov
Äîáðûé Àäìèíèñòðàòîð (èíîãäà)


: 06.03.2005
: 12000
: Îáåð-ãðóïïåí-äîöåíò, ñò. ðóêîâîäèòåëü ãðóïïû ñêîðîñòíûõ ñâèíãåðîâ, îí æå Çàáàøëåâè÷ Îöààò Ïîýëåâè÷

: , 6 2009, 23:25:55     :

Áó-ãà-ãà! Ìû íå ïîñåëåíöû, ìû îðòîäîêñû, íàñ íåëüçÿ çàìîðàæèâàòü.

ß ïëÿêàëü! Æèâóò â ïîñåëåíèè, íà îêêóïèðîâàííûõ òåððèòîðèÿõ - íî íå ïîñåëåíöû. Òèïà, èñòèííûå ñèîíèñòû êîòîðûå íå èäåîëîãèè ðàäè, à òîêìî âîëåé ïîñëàâøåãî èõ òóäà Ðàáèíà, ïåðååõàëè èç Èåðóñàëèìà íà îêêóïèðîâàííûå òåððèòîðèè.

À ñåé÷àñ, òèïà, áåç-ïÿòè-ìèíóò áåæåíöû, ïðîñòî òàêè â îò÷àÿííîì ïîëîæåíèè, õóæå ÷åì â Ñóäàíå.

Ïðè÷¸ì, êàê èñòèííûå ñèîíèñòû, ëûæè òî íàâîñòðÿþò íå â Èåðóñàëèì (òàì òàêàÿ äîðîãîâèçíà, ôè! è ñêó÷åííîñòü), íî â Øòàòû.

Íó íàòóðàëüíî: êóäà æ åù¸ ïîäàòüñÿ èñòèííîìó ñèîíèñòó. À òå èì Green Card íå ïðåäëàãàþò.......Û-Û.......

Ìýð Áåéòàð-Èëèòà – Îáàìå: ìû íå ïîñåëåíöû, íàñ íåëüçÿ "çàìîðàæèâàòü"

Áåéòàð-Èëèò
Ìýð Áåéòàð-Èëèòà, áîëüøèíñòâî íàñåëåíèÿ êîòîðîãî ñîñòàâëÿþò ïðåäñòàâèòåëè óëüòðàîðòîäîêñàëüíîé îáùèíû, îáðàòèëñÿ ñåãîäíÿ ê àäìèíèñòðàöèè ïðåçèäåíòà Îáàìû ñ òðåáîâàíèåì èñêëþ÷èòü ýòîò ãîðîä èç ñïèñêà íàñåëåííûõ ïóíêòîâ, ïîäëåæàùèõ çàìîðàæèâàíèþ.

Îá ýòîì ïèøåò â âîñêðåñåíüå, 6 äåêàáðÿ, ñàéò ãàçåòû The Jerusalem Post.

 ñâîåì îáðàùåíèè ìýð Ìåèð Ðóáèíøòåéí óêàçûâàåò íà òî, ÷òî Áåéòàð-Èëèò íå îòíîñèòñÿ ê ÷èñëó "èäåîëîãè÷åñêè ìîòèâèðîâàííûõ ïîñåëåíèé", è óòâåðæäàåò, ÷òî "íàñòîÿùèì íà÷àëüíèêîì" çäåñü ÿâëÿåòñÿ ÑØÀ, à íå èçðàèëüñêîå ïðàâèòåëüñòâî.

Ðóáèíøòåéí íàïîìèíàåò, ÷òî ïðàâèòåëüñòâî Ðàáèíà è ïîñëåäóþùèå èçðàèëüñêèå ïðàâèòåëüñòâà, êàê ïðàâîãî, òàê è ëåâîãî òîëêà, ïîääåðæèâàëè ñòðîèòåëüñòâî Áåéòàð-Èëèòà, íå îñòàâèâ æèòåëÿì âîçìîæíîñòè âîçâîäèòü äîìà âíóòðè "çåëåíîé ÷åðòû".

Èçäàíèå îòìå÷àåò, ÷òî óëüòðàîðòîäîêñû, íàñåëÿþùèå Áåéòàð-Èëèò, âûáðàëè åãî èç ñîîáðàæåíèé ýêîíîìèè, ñòðåìÿñü èçáåæàòü âûñîêèõ öåí è ñêó÷åííîñòè íàñåëåíèÿ, õàðàêòåðíûõ äëÿ ðåëèãèîçíûõ ðàéîíîâ Èåðóñàëèìà è Áíåé-Áðàêà.

Ìýð óáåæäåí, ÷òî ïîëîæåíèå æèòåëåé ýòîãî ãîðîäà õóæå, ÷åì ïîëîæåíèå áåæåíöåâ èç Ñóäàíà: èõ íå õîòÿò ïðèíèìàòü íè Èçðàèëü, íè Àìåðèêà.

Ðóáèíøòåéí òàêæå íàïîìèíàåò, ÷òî åãî ñåìüÿ, êàê è ðÿä äðóãèõ, ñîñòàâëÿþùèõ ÿäðî ãîðîäà, ïðèáûëè â Çåìëþ Îáåòîâàííóþ çàäîëãî äî îñíîâàíèÿ Ãîñóäàðñòâà Èçðàèëü è ïðîæèâàëè â Èåðóñàëèìå – ïîêîëåíèå çà ïîêîëåíèåì. Ìýð óáåæäåí, ÷òî èìåííî îíè è ÿâëÿþòñÿ "ïîäëèííûìè ñèîíèñòàìè", ïðèáûâøèìè â Ýðåö Èñðàýëü ïî ðåëèãèîçíûì, à íå èäåîëîãè÷åñêèì ñîîáðàæåíèÿì.

Íàïîìíèì, ÷òî Áåéòàð-Èëèò, êàê è Ìîäèèí-Èëèò – êðóïíåéøèé èç ðåëèãèîçíûõ íàñåëåííûõ ïóíêòîâ, ðàñïîëîæåííûé íà "òåððèòîðèÿõ". Â îáîèõ ãîðîäàõ íàáëþäàåòñÿ ñàìûé âûñîêèé â ñòðàíå óðîâåíü ðîæäàåìîñòè. Ñîãëàñíî äàííûì Öåíòðàëüíîãî áþðî ñòàòèñòèêè, íà êàæäóþ âçðîñëóþ æèòåëüíèöó Áåéòàð-Èëèòà ïðèõîäèòñÿ, â ñðåäíåì, 8 äåòåé.

Ìýð Ðóáèíøòåéí íàñòàèâàåò íà òîì, ÷òî äàæå âðåìåííîå çàìîðàæèâàíèå ñòðîèòåëüñòâà ñîâåðøåííî íåïðèåìëåìî çäåñü – ñ ó÷åòîì îãðîìíîãî åñòåñòâåííîãî ïðèðîñòà íàñåëåíèÿ. Îíî òàêæå ïðè÷èíèò íåïîïðàâèìûé ìàòåðèàëüíûé óùåðá äåñÿòêàì ñåìåé, êîòîðûå óæå ïîäïèñàëè ñòðîèòåëüíûå êîíòðàêòû è ïðîäàëè ñâîè äîìà â îæèäàíèè íîâîé æèëïëîùàäè.
_________________
A la guerre comme a la guerre èëè âòîðàÿ ðåäàêöèÿ Çàáóãîðíîâà
koshka



: 24.05.2006
: 876
: Israel,Mexico,Israel

: , 7 2009, 17:58:57     :

Zabougornov ():
Áó-ãà-ãà! Ìû íå ïîñåëåíöû, ìû îðòîäîêñû, íàñ íåëüçÿ çàìîðàæèâàòü.

ß ïëÿêàëü! Æèâóò â ïîñåëåíèè, íà îêêóïèðîâàííûõ òåððèòîðèÿõ - íî íå ïîñåëåíöû. Òèïà, èñòèííûå ñèîíèñòû êîòîðûå íå èäåîëîãèè ðàäè, à òîêìî âîëåé ïîñëàâøåãî èõ òóäà Ðàáèíà, ïåðååõàëè èç Èåðóñàëèìà íà îêêóïèðîâàííûå òåððèòîðèè.

À ñåé÷àñ, òèïà, áåç-ïÿòè-ìèíóò áåæåíöû, ïðîñòî òàêè â îò÷àÿííîì ïîëîæåíèè, õóæå ÷åì â Ñóäàíå.

Ïðè÷¸ì, êàê èñòèííûå ñèîíèñòû, ëûæè òî íàâîñòðÿþò íå â Èåðóñàëèì (òàì òàêàÿ äîðîãîâèçíà, ôè! è ñêó÷åííîñòü), íî â Øòàòû.

Íó íàòóðàëüíî: êóäà æ åù¸ ïîäàòüñÿ èñòèííîìó ñèîíèñòó. À òå èì Green Card íå ïðåäëàãàþò.......Û-Û.......

Ìýð Áåéòàð-Èëèòà – Îáàìå: ìû íå ïîñåëåíöû, íàñ íåëüçÿ "çàìîðàæèâàòü"

Áåéòàð-Èëèò
Ìýð Áåéòàð-Èëèòà, áîëüøèíñòâî íàñåëåíèÿ êîòîðîãî ñîñòàâëÿþò ïðåäñòàâèòåëè óëüòðàîðòîäîêñàëüíîé îáùèíû, îáðàòèëñÿ ñåãîäíÿ ê àäìèíèñòðàöèè ïðåçèäåíòà Îáàìû ñ òðåáîâàíèåì èñêëþ÷èòü ýòîò ãîðîä èç ñïèñêà íàñåëåííûõ ïóíêòîâ, ïîäëåæàùèõ çàìîðàæèâàíèþ.

Îá ýòîì ïèøåò â âîñêðåñåíüå, 6 äåêàáðÿ, ñàéò ãàçåòû The Jerusalem Post.

 ñâîåì îáðàùåíèè ìýð Ìåèð Ðóáèíøòåéí óêàçûâàåò íà òî, ÷òî Áåéòàð-Èëèò íå îòíîñèòñÿ ê ÷èñëó "èäåîëîãè÷åñêè ìîòèâèðîâàííûõ ïîñåëåíèé", è óòâåðæäàåò, ÷òî "íàñòîÿùèì íà÷àëüíèêîì" çäåñü ÿâëÿåòñÿ ÑØÀ, à íå èçðàèëüñêîå ïðàâèòåëüñòâî.

Ðóáèíøòåéí íàïîìèíàåò, ÷òî ïðàâèòåëüñòâî Ðàáèíà è ïîñëåäóþùèå èçðàèëüñêèå ïðàâèòåëüñòâà, êàê ïðàâîãî, òàê è ëåâîãî òîëêà, ïîääåðæèâàëè ñòðîèòåëüñòâî Áåéòàð-Èëèòà, íå îñòàâèâ æèòåëÿì âîçìîæíîñòè âîçâîäèòü äîìà âíóòðè "çåëåíîé ÷åðòû".

Èçäàíèå îòìå÷àåò, ÷òî óëüòðàîðòîäîêñû, íàñåëÿþùèå Áåéòàð-Èëèò, âûáðàëè åãî èç ñîîáðàæåíèé ýêîíîìèè, ñòðåìÿñü èçáåæàòü âûñîêèõ öåí è ñêó÷åííîñòè íàñåëåíèÿ, õàðàêòåðíûõ äëÿ ðåëèãèîçíûõ ðàéîíîâ Èåðóñàëèìà è Áíåé-Áðàêà.

Ìýð óáåæäåí, ÷òî ïîëîæåíèå æèòåëåé ýòîãî ãîðîäà õóæå, ÷åì ïîëîæåíèå áåæåíöåâ èç Ñóäàíà: èõ íå õîòÿò ïðèíèìàòü íè Èçðàèëü, íè Àìåðèêà.

Ðóáèíøòåéí òàêæå íàïîìèíàåò, ÷òî åãî ñåìüÿ, êàê è ðÿä äðóãèõ, ñîñòàâëÿþùèõ ÿäðî ãîðîäà, ïðèáûëè â Çåìëþ Îáåòîâàííóþ çàäîëãî äî îñíîâàíèÿ Ãîñóäàðñòâà Èçðàèëü è ïðîæèâàëè â Èåðóñàëèìå – ïîêîëåíèå çà ïîêîëåíèåì. Ìýð óáåæäåí, ÷òî èìåííî îíè è ÿâëÿþòñÿ "ïîäëèííûìè ñèîíèñòàìè", ïðèáûâøèìè â Ýðåö Èñðàýëü ïî ðåëèãèîçíûì, à íå èäåîëîãè÷åñêèì ñîîáðàæåíèÿì.

Íàïîìíèì, ÷òî Áåéòàð-Èëèò, êàê è Ìîäèèí-Èëèò – êðóïíåéøèé èç ðåëèãèîçíûõ íàñåëåííûõ ïóíêòîâ, ðàñïîëîæåííûé íà "òåððèòîðèÿõ". Â îáîèõ ãîðîäàõ íàáëþäàåòñÿ ñàìûé âûñîêèé â ñòðàíå óðîâåíü ðîæäàåìîñòè. Ñîãëàñíî äàííûì Öåíòðàëüíîãî áþðî ñòàòèñòèêè, íà êàæäóþ âçðîñëóþ æèòåëüíèöó Áåéòàð-Èëèòà ïðèõîäèòñÿ, â ñðåäíåì, 8 äåòåé.

Ìýð Ðóáèíøòåéí íàñòàèâàåò íà òîì, ÷òî äàæå âðåìåííîå çàìîðàæèâàíèå ñòðîèòåëüñòâà ñîâåðøåííî íåïðèåìëåìî çäåñü – ñ ó÷åòîì îãðîìíîãî åñòåñòâåííîãî ïðèðîñòà íàñåëåíèÿ. Îíî òàêæå ïðè÷èíèò íåïîïðàâèìûé ìàòåðèàëüíûé óùåðá äåñÿòêàì ñåìåé, êîòîðûå óæå ïîäïèñàëè ñòðîèòåëüíûå êîíòðàêòû è ïðîäàëè ñâîè äîìà â îæèäàíèè íîâîé æèëïëîùàäè.

Áó-ãà-ãà Mr. Green
Âðåò!!!! Âî ãàä! Ïîðÿäî÷íûé îðòîäîêñ íå ìîæåò áûòü ñèîíèñòîì. Äàæå î ãðàæäàíñòâå èçðàÈëüñêîì äóìàòü íå äîëæåí. Êòî äóìàåò... äåíüãè ó íèõ íà èóäåéñêîì óìå...
Çàáóãîðíîâ, Âû áû ññûëî÷êó, øîá ïîðÿäî÷íîìó êðèòèêó ïðàâèòåëüñòâà â ñåòè íå ðûòüñÿ...
Zabougornov
Äîáðûé Àäìèíèñòðàòîð (èíîãäà)


: 06.03.2005
: 12000
: Îáåð-ãðóïïåí-äîöåíò, ñò. ðóêîâîäèòåëü ãðóïïû ñêîðîñòíûõ ñâèíãåðîâ, îí æå Çàáàøëåâè÷ Îöààò Ïîýëåâè÷

: , 7 2009, 18:55:41     :

Âîò è ññûëêà
http://newsru.co.il/israel/06dec2009/beitar456.html
_________________
A la guerre comme a la guerre èëè âòîðàÿ ðåäàêöèÿ Çàáóãîðíîâà
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